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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.18 19:06:00 -
[1]
 Originally by: Venkul Mul
- chances of inventing a BPO, 1/100 is way too high when people can run 10 jobs every 2,5 hours, 1/1000 will rise cries of "cheating" when someone get a good one;
1/1000 would mean id have 10-15 BPOs for certain t2 modules thus id flood market easily already. With invention jobs going not into thousands but tens (for single players) or even hundreds of thousands (corps/alliances) BPOs would spawn way faster than they have ever been introduced.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.18 21:11:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Banker jack
well the odds I was thinking of would be more like 1/5,000,000 or even 1/10,000,000 like i said very very slim chance
So what oyu are saying is: bring back lottery just instead of having RPs = tickets, you will have "amount of invention jobs done = tickets".
Anyways, no. And we dont need any more t2 BPOs in game.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.18 23:37:00 -
[3]
Yes. Because BPO owner gets 70 mil, inventor gets 30mil is bad. I way preferred pre-invention times when owner got 500mil and inventor... huh? what inventor?
And if you think invention is not worth it - dont use it. System is perfect right now.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.20 22:00:00 -
[4]
Quote:
There must be a very large language barrier here. Do you own a T2 and now it isn't profitable? You are not make much sense in english.
If you are making your isk from invention, why are you so vehement about keeping T2 BPOs?
Because:
1. that tiny bit of t2 BPOs give me (and de facto not only me because income is lower than invention anyways) ability to get some modules under 1mil a piece
2. because i INVESTED in t2 BPOs. I bought em paying ISK and they never gave me back what i invested. Unless i get back my investition + some income (for 6 months i have em now) you can pretty much buzz off from "remove t2 BPOs".
Or there is 3rd way. I WILL scrap my BPOs (put em in a can and blow em up) if YOU offer to pay me for doing so. Happy?
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.21 14:26:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Vadimik
Originally by: Striking Owl
You make the point I was trying to establish with my sarcasm. The truly good T2 BPOs just aren't out there for sale. But even if they where, I for one couldn't afford to buy it even IF I wanted to.
Oh, it turns out that there are ways to get a T2 BPO ?
And the whole issue is about you not having the isk to buy it ?
Its classic "Waah waah im poor i WANT CCP to give t2 BPO to me".
@ whiner:
No hun, this time you need to GET ISK and then BUY t2 BPO. And you will see how PROFITABLE it is. Maybe after you BUY one you will love waiting 2-3 years to get back what you invested.
Also why you cry about "crap ones"? Seems people are USING them and BUILDING from them (ergo you get cheap drones, cheap t2 ammo and stuff). Its not effing charity - if you think they make money out of t2 BPO - buy even crap one and try to "make iskies". Otherwise seriously stfu.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.21 15:10:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 21/01/2008 15:14:29
Edited by: Deva Blackfire on 21/01/2008 15:14:00
Originally by: Striking Owl
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
@ whiner:
No hun, this time you need to GET ISK and then BUY t2 BPO. And you will see how PROFITABLE it is. Maybe after you BUY one you will love waiting 2-3 years to get back what you invested.
2-3 years? You where robbed if you made a deal like that. How would you know EVE is even going to be around that long?
Its been around for almost 5 years now. If you arent ADHD "i need new MMO every month" kid then youd know that this game will easily last 10 years.
Originally by: Striking Owl
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Also why you cry about "crap ones"?
My point is easiest to illustrate using the areas where completion is tighter. That is why I used the less valuable ones.
Yes. Thats why best idea is to use cheapest ones like 75mm railgun. All we know they sell at 60k a piece from BPO and around 0,6mil from invention. This means that EVERY INVENTION IS 10x MORE EXPENSIVE ! OMG !.
No. Next time try checking sth that is actually used for invention to calculate costs. Or maybe dont bother because it seems handling any numbers are giving you headache and "cry on th forums" symptoms.
Originally by: Striking Owl
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Seems people are USING them and BUILDING from them (ergo you get cheap drones, cheap t2 ammo and stuff).
Yeah, we are getting that now, post invention, from the BPO owner. How lucky we are.
Because pre-invention all NPCs dropped t2 drones and t2 ammo (coz noone produced em anyways).
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.21 23:03:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Internet Knight
snip
You know? Fck it. Lets remove invention. Ppl wont have any point to whine over abt anymore.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.22 06:21:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Ira Theos
That is a minor issue that can be addressed by converting them to fixed number copy BPCs at what ever number seems fit to CCP to use, so long as the number is low enough to end the monopoly within a matter of a few months.
Ok. Seriously you guys annoy me. Show me EXACTLY WHICH t2 BPOS are MONOPOLISING market. No "the cheaper ones" or "ship ones" from thin air. Exact names.
Quote:
But the BPO's must go..... not because some single owner is getting rich, but because the reality is that the most useful BPOs for the best combat ships and really useful equipment are, by and large owned by Alliances that acquired them from the players that won them in the lottery.
So. Alliances did EXACTLY what some ppl here are telling YOU to do. They BOUGHT BPOs. And still you cant swallow it. Bitter that whole alliances (multi-player society with numbers going as high as 5000 members) managed to BUY (no lottery involved in buying) item that PROFITS them?
What next? Ban alliances from building supercapitals? Because they CAN and you CAN NOT?
Quote:
These BPOs give these Alliances a cost advantage on the ships and equipment they use to defend the zero space areas in which they moon mine and carry on other activitites that generate isk at rates that cannot be matched in high sec.
Again - exact numbers. Ill give you small hint: there are 40 BPOs per t2 item (except ammo which are tad higher and im excluding ones on banned/inactive accounts). Now its time for your homework. Count the "insane amoun of isk that is being made".
Quote:
The "profit" issue to individual players from the monopoly power is and always has been irrelevent. THE REAL ISSUE IS THE PRODUCTION COST ADVANTAGE THAT THESE ALLIANCES POSSESS BY REASON OF THEIR BPO OWNERSHIP WHICH GIVES THEM AN UNCHALLENGEABLE ADVANTAGE IN ANY WAR OF ATTRITION. This is why BPOs must go.
Like above. Whats next? "The issue is that alliances have put towers over 2 years ago. Unanchor all POSes CCP so we have chance"?
Quote:
The Beta Alliances that control most of the moon mining operations in the game have enjoyed this advantage almost from the first day the BPO lottery was introduced.
OheMeFGee: I hit it in the nail in previous line. "CCP give us moons because alliances use em and i want too". That was sooo UNEXPECTED.
Quote:
After all, what use was a T2 BPO to some player that was incapable of utilizing it because of lack of skills, infrastructure, materials, or personnel necessary to build with it?
I hope you realise building from BPO is EXACTLY same as building from t2 BPC? And no infrastructure or superpower is needed, just some time. Ppl sold BPOs because break even times were 1-1,5+ years (especially on ships).
Quote:
The Lottery was a bad game design decision and it was inevitable that these BPOs would find their way into the hands that had the deepest pockets from the moment they were introduced. They must go!
ISK still goes to those ppl. BPO or not they do have enough brains to turn any ocassion into advantage. Others prefer whine on forums.
Quote:
If they don't go, we can all quit Eve today, because no new power base (other than Goons who bring unusual numbers of pilots or RA who bring cash bought isk) will ever change the face of zero. As long as the BPOs exist, zero is set in cement.
Can i have your stuff? And i hope door hit you on the way out.
Quote:
If you want to know why more high skilled players are staying in empire... this is the reason. Unless you are a defender of the monopoly powers, a Goon, or a player willing to metagame isk however you can, you have no reason to be in zero. It is a losing bet with no point.
Ever heard of word "fun"? Or "exploration"? Or "chaining"? Or "dictors/bombs"? Look - ONLY 0.0 stuff! Surprised?
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.22 11:24:00 -
[9]
Ah one more thing.
"There are no good BPOs for sale only crap ones":
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=688157
Why noone from whiners in this thread bid on that GOOD bpo? :)
Ah and yes im hostile. Because same thing with same arguments appear almost every other month since invention started.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.22 14:46:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Venkul Mul
Granted, but the "once a month" big request can be one of the alternate option for exploration: "get item x for my research", when item x is found only in a archeological site spawned in 0.0 will give an new reason to do exploration.
Waaaaa! Waaaa! Alliances are controlling 0.0 and we veteran empire players cant do anything. Waaaa! Waaaa! (just read page 3, you will know what i was smoking ;p)
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.01.22 15:12:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Vadimik
Man, do we really need to take those guys in consideration ? 
Arent they the ones who always cause most problems?
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